Buying from classifieds... [Archive]

SkieGryph

01-10-2003, 08:13 PM

My current main source for trying to find me another dog (Either great dane, German shepherd, or Husky) is in the papers EVERY DAY :7 in the classified section. They usually have about 5-6 different danes for about around 500-600$. Which is out of my price range for just buying a dane (the post isnt about the cost, if I get a dog I have to pay for getting the dog and my parents will pay for food, vet visits ect, so lets not start an argument :+ ) Im just wondering some things I should ask when I find a dane and call on it. My dad is going to start making me call about anydogs I'm looking for... (Darn him for making me interact with other people!!! :P ) Just wondering. And what kind of things should I look over in a puppy?

witzn

01-10-2003, 08:27 PM

Why is this your main source for finding any sort of dog?

It would make more sense if you wanted to limit yourself to that option to instead check local breed rescue groups or the humane society.

If that is not possible and you cannot contact any reputable breeders or afford a puppy, cannot rescue a dog, then the only
thing I would call ads in the paper for is to check if the dog's priced has dropped to free, or certainly not more than a hundred dollars or so.

Why? because at that point that dog is as likely a gamble as a rescue and as much effort has been put into breeding it, why over pay?

alicat613

01-10-2003, 08:49 PM

You seem a bit in a hurry. Why don't you wait until the right thing comes along?

Please don't buy a dog out of the newspaper. It only encourages the people who breed puppies to advertise them, and encourages the people who just sell their dogs when they move. There is no place in classified ads for pets IMO. A pet is a family member, not an object.

Instead of aiding these people do something that is not in the best interest of animals as a whole, why not stay involved with local rescues and waiting for fate to work its magic? I'm sure if you keep your eyes open, one of these days there will be a rescue there that you know is meant for you. And that will feel so much better than just picking up the cheapest dog you can find the soonest.

01-10-2003, 09:04 PM

When I was looking for a puppy, I kept clippings of every newspaper ad for Great Danes in a folder. Why?? So I would know who NOT to call in case I ever ran across that phone number again, like at the vet's or on a bulletin board at Pet Smart or something.

An adult rescue that has been evaluated by knowledgable Dane people is a wonderful first Great Dane. That's how I got my first Dane, and he was wonderful.

mp

SkieGryph

01-10-2003, 09:30 PM

I know what all you are saying is absolutly true. And every day I volonteer at OHS I make a quick rounds and look for any dog I could rescue. Living out in the boonies limits the ability to find rescues. I'm not trying to rush it, if I was I would have already just put down money and bought a puppy, I know its more than that. Which also brings another point, since I have had Gabby for a while (got her after she was already full grown) I want to raise a great dane from a puppy. I dont want to raise a puppy just for the experiance, its more of a bonding thing (I have raised puppies before, please dont get the wrong idea...) I still love my Gabby and Annie more than anything :7

danelvr

01-10-2003, 10:47 PM

i consider kash my mistake dog, i knew what i shoudl ahve done, but still did wrong, and will never again support a BYB(someone from the paper). if you work at a rescue you should realize that the reason those dogs are in there, is because of people buying from people in the newspaper, and irresponsible breedings.

i would wait until im older if i were you to get another puppy. youre about my age i think, and even if you DO live in the boonies, you(im assuming) will go to college oneday, and it takes about 3 years for a dane to mature. in three years, wont you be in college or on your own? meaning, you will be in an apartment with a great dane, while working and going to school, leaving little time for a dog?

if kahs is put to sleep, im not getting another puppy. kash is finally getting to the age where i can go hang with freinds every once in a while, without feeling guilty. but for a good year, there was none of that going on, no freinds, lol. there is no way in hell im rushing into getting another puppy. i could not deal with a puppy right now in my life, and dont know how im dealing with kash being sick

anyway, just going through this with my dog has deturred me from ever buying from someone who is irresponsible ever again. there has been no support from that breeder, and it feels terrible to know that someone that brought a lif einto this world, that you bought, does not give a rats a$$ about whether it lives dies, or suffers.

anyway, if i were you i would wait until im older to get a dane. great danes are very expensive, kash was 1000. and his medical expenses, although not as high as some members(mandi comes to mind) have been rather high with allergies, and this wobblers stuff. and if it wasnt for DOL i would not have the options i have now.

well ill get off my soapbox. i just am trying to get across to you that while puppies bond wonderfully, and are cute, they are demanding, and if you are planning on moving out it might not be the most responsible thing in the world. im going to rescue a mutt from the pound that is older, if kash is not able to be saved.

Carol

01-11-2003, 06:15 AM

Sarah, Wobblers is a problem that any of us can have. There are no tests to run to check your breeding stock for it. In many cases wobblers doesn't show up in the puppy stage but comes on later in life like around 6 yrs of age. This is one case where I wouldn't blame your breeder for the problem. Now, if one of her adult breeding stock is known to be a Wobblers then I would blame her for producing a pup with it but otherwise it's just one of those things. You can buy from a well known breeder and still get a pup with Wobblers. Many Calif top breeders had problems with it quite a few years back. I'm sorry your first dane had this problem and hope you will not give up on the breed.

Bev_K

01-11-2003, 09:40 AM

One of the problems with calling ads in the paper is that you will run across some really good salesmen. Unless you are very strong willed and very educated as to what exactly makes an ethical breeder, you will probably fall prey. I say this because it happens every day.

Yes, occasionally a good breeder will use the classified ads. But, the percentage of good breeders compared to the uneducated/unethical breeders that advertise in this fashion make the odds stacked against you.

There are always other options. Visit a dog show and meet Dane exhibitors there (yeah, you might only have one or two dog shows in a year that are close enough to you, but we all know that buying a puppy shouldn't fall under time constrictions or you'll likely make foolish decisions). Check out www.infodog.com for lists of shows. Click on Show Information and then Search by State. Then click on the state you are interested in and look for an All-Breed show or a Specialty for Danes.

If you really think you "have" to use the paper to find breeders, realize that it will probably take just as long (or longer!) this way to find an ethical breeder. The only difference is you'll be tempted with all sorts of cute & cuddly puppies.

What questions should you ask? Read this for help - http://sunnysidefarm.com/intrview.html .

Life speeds up after 18, so even though it may take awhile to get to 18, once there the years go faster and faster. :) It really isn't as painful as you might imagine to wait for certain things. ;-)

Best of luck.

Bev

danelvr

01-11-2003, 10:35 AM

i know that wobblers can be in any line, what i was trying to get across was the fact that it would be nice to have breeder support through something like this. i have called my breeder several times in teh past 2 weeks, and written her several e mails, and i have not gotten one return call or e mail, even though its her that brought this pup into the world. that is what i was trying to say, not that shes bad because he got wobblers

witzn

01-11-2003, 11:39 AM

From your intro you have at least 2 dogs?

And although you've had the one "for awhile" I think you said
the oldest was 4 yrs? The dogs you listed were all what I would
consider young, actually in the prime of life.

I do not understand how someone that supports shelters can
consider financially backing the people that put dogs in shelters.
(which any litter does since even if those pups go to good homes they just took the homes away from pet dogs already
existing - and one reason why each breeding should be done
for better reasons than needing cash or wanting more pet
dogs)

As Sarah said, in the next 10 yrs likely you will be very busy
and a 3rd dog might not be an easy addition.

Personally I would suggest you do more things with the dogs
you have and bond with them. There are many dogsports out
there and living in the boonies is an asset to some of them.
Obedience, tracking, agility, pet therapy - there is so much to
do that a person doesn't always need a puppy fix to get the
most out of their companion animals.

Oregon is not so remote that there are not breeders, dog
shows that are not too far away, let alone contacts available
through email and dane magazines. I still don't see why
a newspaper ad provides any benefit at all, other than of
course it is very easy to call and get a dog, especially versus
the research and contacts and planning required to get
a quality pet puppy (who will likely be priced the same or
lower).

MuchAdo

01-11-2003, 11:45 AM

>My current main source for trying to find me another dog
>(Either great dane, German shepherd, or Husky)

You've already had some good responses about the classifieds, but I wanted to point up something here. You REALLY need to decide what kind of dog you want before you go shopping. Danes, Shepherds, and Huskies (I assume you mean Siberians--call a Malamute a Husky and watch the breeders run away from you) have incredibly different temperaments, health issues, and needs. If you really think you could be satisfied with any of the above, you haven't done enough research. And if you call good breeders, as soon as they realize that you haven't decided on a breed you'll be mentally put in the "not ready for a puppy" pile. Heck, I don't even like it when people haven't decided on a color!

As a breeder, I want a person that calls me and says, here's my name, here's the research I've done, I've decided definitely on a blue, I agree with your feeding and care policies, and I'm ready to wait for a puppy. If someone calls and says, I am looking for a puppy and am trying to decide between you and a harl puppy from XX breeder, I say take the harl puppy and have a nice day--I am not out to convince anyone to buy my dogs and I don't want any prospective buyer who has the mentality that any available puppy will do.

Since I know I am not alone in this feeling, how much MORE will breeders dismiss you if you haven't even decided on a breed yet?

Joanna Kimball
Much Ado Danes
muchadodanes@direcway.com

SkieGryph

01-11-2003, 11:56 AM

> You REALLY need to decide what kind of dog you want before you go shopping. Danes, Shepherds, and Huskies

Well I am just saying, I dont think its a bad thing to want more than one of kind of dog. Just because you get a great dane doesnt mean you cant get a German shepherd too. I dont mean to start any arguments...

And yes I did mean Siberian huskies, I just had to sign off before I could go back and proof-read my post.

Carol

01-11-2003, 11:59 AM

I agree with you. I am no kind of a salesman for my pups.:) Usually price is their first issue and I'm more than happy to let them buy elsewhere.

gmac

01-13-2003, 11:16 AM

There's no reason a person who owns a Dane cannot own a Shepherd, or a Husky, but the point was (forgive me if I'm wrong) that if you haven't made up your mind 300% that a Dane is what you want, and nothing else will do, then you aren't committed enough.

I'm the first one to be guilty of that. I love many different breeds of dogs, and was really on the fence about three years ago. I had my heart set on an Akita or a Dane. A pup of either breed would have made me very happy. My husband cast his vote for Dane, and after lengthy discussion with several Akita breeders, I decided to put that on hold until my daughter is a teenager. I had to turn down a beautiful little pick of hte litter boy whose testicals weren't descending properly, and I STILL have his picture at home.

The point is, I made my choices based on common sense and not whim. I can't believe someone who volunteers in a shelter doesn't see the result of impulse-adoptions.

leilia

01-13-2003, 09:07 PM

Breeders looking to make some quick money and buyers trying to buy a quick puppy complement each other perfectly. And the place which accomodates them the best is the classifieds.

Of course you can get health guarantees, breeder support, sound pedigree, ofa and other testing, and the knowledge that your puppy is the result of years of effort and careful planning. Or you can get a bargain puppy from the paper. The truth is, you get what you pay for pretty much.

Of course, there are people who insist on gambling with the classifieds, even given all that. I'll never understand it, myself. I mean, of course there's the appeal of the idea of a puppy, shopping as easily as you would a new bunk bed in the next sectioin over, but the truth is, you have already limited almost 100% of all reasonably ethical breeders by looking in the classifieds. In truth, it's kind of a breeder taboo; it shows you are desperate for buyers, and their $$$$. So even if an ethical breeder wanted to get the word out that they have puppies available, they would never use the classifieds. They would rather keep the puppy for however long it takes to find a good home than take out an add in their local paper. The kind of inquiries such a public announcement invites are not good. People who look in the paper for animals can be anyone from impulse buyers, to those looking for animals to sell to labs for research. These kinds of people are everywhere, and obviously any breeder that cares even a bit about where their puppies end up wouldn't even want these people with their phone number.

It all boils down to one thing: the odds of buying from anyone resembling an ethical breeder who advertises in the classifieds is very, very slim. But, if you don't really care that much, then it doesn't really matter anyway.

There are so many better ways to look for a puppy. The breeder listings on this site would be a start. Don't let a little distance scare you; what are the odds that your perfect puppy will be in your neighborhood?

Then again, you can't beat the classifieds for convenient shopping... puppies now in every breed at bargain prices! But one puppy does not equal another. I see that now even with my girl. Everyone thinks my puppy is older than the dog down the block. People say she's so gorgeous, so big, so typical. But in actuality, it's just Gen's breeding shining through; the dog down the block is a year older than she is! Don't think unexperienced people won't notice a well-bred dog, because they will; type in a great dane is easy to recognize.

Just some stuff to keep in mind as you're shopping.

wyndius

01-17-2003, 05:46 PM

Well here's my $.02, I have been in your place (sort of), I know alot of people say go to rescue or find an ethical breeder, when I was first looking for a puppy I wouldn't qualify for a rescue, and most ethical breeders wouldn't give me the time of day. I wound up buying my first puppy from a junk yard. You didn't say how young it would have to be, but I would first let all the shelters know what I was looking for and that they have your number, if there are that many in your local paper then surely some of them wind up in shelters, the only problem is pure bred puppies don't usually end up at the shelter. Another idea would be to look for an individual that has rescued a pup they want to place, they aren't usually as choosy as a breed rescue.

Some other things to consider, Is this going to be your puppy or a family dog? If it is going to be yours have you thought about what you are going to do when you move out? If you plan to leave the pup behind I would reconsider getting one. Are you planning to devote yourself to this dog for the rest of its life, if you are not please don't get one. Anyway I just wanted to be sure you are thinking of these things, good luck.

SkieGryph

01-21-2003, 08:06 PM

I dont know how else to put it. Its not wrong to want more than one kind of dog. It is totally rediculous to say 'You have to only want one breed, other wise your not commited enough' I love great danes but also love other dogs too. I dont know how else to explain it.

alicat613

01-21-2003, 08:44 PM

Slow down!!!! Dogs are not a collectible.
You were posting a while back (not too long ago) how much you wanted a Dane (on another board). You got her, and already you are not satisfied. I would be so sad if I were your Dane and knew that all you could think about was getting some other dog. It seems to me you have this idealistic dog situation in mind and this girl did not fill it. But you can't just keep begging for dogs until this need or desire is finally fulfilled. These are living breathing creatures. So now you want a dog of these 3 breeds from the paper. What then? After you have supported and encouraged the poor breeding of the dogs, will you be happy then? How do you know this time this dog, a dog that you are only able to research by looking in the want ads, will be this dream dog you seem to be seeking? And what then if he's not? Beg for more dogs?

D4D

01-22-2003, 02:46 AM

I would like to think I am an ethical breeder (of albeit Jack Russell Terriers), I am a little bit offended by saying that anyone who advertises must be a BYB.
At our stud, we having been looking for (and trying to breed, if it is ever going to be possible :D ) an Under 12" show marked tan & white smooth coat male that does NOT have "Queen Anne" legs, is spannable (ie: can still be used for hunting, which the dogs were originally for, but the majority of "show dogs" would fail achieve), and is not of the current "majority" bloodlines.
Now, sounds pretty easy I suppose - Just find a "titled" female, & a "titled" male, & breed them, and hey presto....... We have a waiting list a mile and a half long for different dogs. Some want smooth coat females, smooth coat males (everyone wants one of these... which means we're growing out pups before they go to a home if not suitable), broken coat males & females, & less often rough coats, "we want one with a white face", etc, etc, etc. With Great Danes, if you've just got a Black to Black mating, or Fawn to Fawn, with nothing else in the background to surprise anyone, then your only going to have Black or Fawn pups, either male or female. So if you've got people wanting a boy or a girl, but has to be Black or Fawn, you're not going to need to advertise.
With the Jack Russells - You don't breed Smooth to smooth every single time, so you can't always say you're only going to have smooth coats.... And it's a pretty good rule to NEVER breed Rough coat to rough coat (although at least you'd know you'd get a batch of non-show quality rough coats)... And Broken coat to Broken coat can give you smooth, broken OR Rough coat (Smooth x Rough can give same combinations). So I've got a waiting list looking for everything EXCEPT the two rough coat females I've got left..... So what do I do????? I had 4 pups born, from a Rough coat female (smooth sire, rough dam) by a Smooth coat male (smooth x smooth) - I got ONE male pup (have orders for 10 male pups..... ;8 ) and three female pups. Two females are rough, one smooth or broken (not sure yet). The male is either going to be smooth (yippeeee :) ) or broken (hmmmm)... but get this: HE's probably going to take after his dam, and be 12" (too tall for what we want).
Sorry for the long post, but if someone can give me an option to what the "ethical" thing to do would be? I don't have a waiting list for any Rough coat females.....

karenivek

02-05-2003, 12:18 PM

I don't think you really need to be limited to the classifieds. I know they're interesting-- heck I read the same ones every day for entertainment (I'm assuming you read the Oregonian). Beavercreek is not the boonies. It's a bedroom community for Portland, for goodness sake! Did you happen to go to the Rose City Classic a few weeks ago? There were lots of wonderful danes there. I believe they had a specialty. You certainly could have spoken with breeders there. Also, are you keeping tabs on the residents at the local shelters, such as Multnomah County? When my husband and I were looking for a dog we perused Clackamas, Multnomah and OHS. Multnomah by far had the most purebred dogs.

Also, please keep in mind what the other posters have pointed out regarding your age and future. As a self-described "geek" I presume you are intending to go to college. It's pretty hard to find housing that will take any dog, and practically impossible to find housing that will take a large dog. I went through a dogless period of several years while in college, and I survived. Because you already have two dogs and are so close to graduating from high school, I urge you to save your money and wait a few years.

fredalina

02-10-2003, 04:11 PM

This is an older posting, so you may not see this post, but i thought i'd ask.

Why is it wrong to not know what color you want, as a "pet" dane buyer? i can maybe see if you're a show prospect buyer or a breeder who is looking for a dane from another line and you have certain ideals (color being a high priority), but why must you know the color? If my favorite color is brindle and my second favorite color is fawn (or mantle-harle or blue-black or whatever), am i wrong in wanting to take a look at the litter to help make my decision? i understand as a "pet" buyer i won't have the option of show prospects, but i'd like to be able to interact with the pups to help make my decision. It might be that i thought i preferred a blue female but when i see the litter (of the "pet" danes in the litter), the blue female has a more dominant temperament (at least appears to at 6-8 weeks of age) and the black female is more submissive, and the male dog i already have at home is very dominant so the submissive one makes a better match for my home. Why would this make me a worse puppy buyer than someone who has their heart set on blue?

fredalina
(who is NOT looking for a puppy but is just curious)

astridj

02-10-2003, 07:27 PM

Why don't you concentrate and properly train the dog you do have? Also, as much as I like GSD's (German Shepherd Dogs) at times they're not very compatible with other dogs and the ones I've seen in past years had a very high prey drive.

MuchAdo

02-11-2003, 12:03 AM

Of course you can be looking for either a fawn or a brindle, etc. But narrowing it down to color family is sort of a first step for a puppy buyer, and if a buyer hasn't gotten that far, or if I feel like they'd be satisfied with the first puppy that came along regardless of color, I'm not interested in convincing them to pick me or pick blue--a color that you usually have to wait a good long time for and that requires some commitment. If they're not really committed to the color I breed, the chance is pretty high that they'll find another available puppy long before either I or another good breeder would have a blue or black for them.

Oh, and one more thing: Beware if a breeder lets you switch gears midway, or if he or she is letting YOU make the decision about which puppy would be a better fit in your family. You couldn't possibly know the puppies as well as the breeder, and you'd never be able to pick a submissive, dominant, fill in the blank puppy as well as the breeder could. Offering you a choice between two or three puppies of similar traits or temperament is one thing, and that certainly might include two colors, but I don't know any good breeders that will let you choose your own puppy from the entire litter.

Joanna Kimball
Much Ado Danes
muchado.vze.com

alicat613

02-11-2003, 12:23 AM

I also think a main point here is just as you have a right to not be certain on color, Joanna has a right to choose her own qualifications on who she places pups with! The colors point I believe came up because of Skie's indecision on breeds, and Joanna was making a point about how important to her it is that potential homes know exactly what they want.

SkieGryph

02-11-2003, 08:39 PM

I have described my plans for college and dogs in other posts, and might get harped on if I do again. If you are not away I volonteer at OHS at least 12 hours a month. To me the boonies is having to drive 30 minutes to get to the nearest friends house (and an hour bus ride to school). I actually missed the Dane thing in portland, I begged, just short of beeing on hands and knees, to go each day for that (if I recall it spanned 4 days) but my parents always had somthing to do. Just a note, I helped some of the 500 dogs from Multinomah get adopted out... also just curious, you've actually heard of Beavercreek?